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Old 09-20-2011, 07:15 PM   #1

Jgos929 is currently offline
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Default Looking for suggestions and recommendations

It appears a couple of weekends ago when we were beached something took a chunk out of the bottom of my boat. From what I could tell it was a sandy bottom and I have a keel guard so I wasn't to worried about it. I learned my lesson and wont be doing that any more. As you can see in the pics there are two chunks missing. The first one just a pice of the guard is missing but the 2nd one actually took some of my boat with it. After all the reviews I've read and the easy how to's I think I am going to use the Marine-Tex putty to fill in the 2nd spot and get it back to where it was before. I also plan on installing another keel guard just for the extra security. My boat is green and the Marine-Tex is white, the guard on it now is also white so I was going to go back with a new green keel guard to better match the boat. After I do the repair with the Marine-Tex is there anything else I need to do to the spot before I put the new guard on? Since its going to be covered should I even bother with touching up the paint? From everything I've read nobody really goes into what they did after the spot was filled and it was always done on a boat with a white bottom.

My next issue as you can see in the pics are a ton of scratches along the bottom of the boat. What can I use to make that look better? I'm pretty handy with an orbital and my best friend owns a detailing company so I should be ok with the equipment aspect of this little project. I just have no idea what products to buy in order to get that back to looking good. I already have boat wax and color restorer but does this call for a rubbing compound of some sort and then come back with a restorer and a wax or can I get buy with the products I already have?

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  • Old 09-23-2011, 09:44 PM   #2
     
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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    Looks like some bad luck there, but could have been worse.

    I have done some heavy repairs on boats including an entrire transom rebuild on my old Maxum and various other 'patch ups'! I am also a Licenced Aircraft Engineer with training on composites, so hopefully I speak with some authority, you can make up your own mind!

    Put simply, there are two types of resin systems. Polyester systems are used for casting, they are cheap and they are what boats are made from. Polyester resin is tough, but its adhesion properties are not as good as epoxy. Epoxy is more impact resistant, more expensive and it has better adhesion. On the face of it, epoxy based systems are better for this type of repair. If you are going to paint over it with an antifoul system for example, then I would use epoxy.

    However, if you intend doing a repair and finishing with a gelcoat, then you have to use polyester based system because gelcoat is polyester based. Rule of thumb is that epoxy will cure over polyester, but polyester systems (gelcoat included) will not cure properly over epoxy (I found out the hard way!).

    Three very important rules:
    1. Ensure the area is dry - cannot stress this enough
    2. Degrease with Methyl ethyl Ketone or similar (assists adhesion and primes surface)
    3. Do the repair in a dry environment, moisture is easily absorbed into the repair in humid conditions which will affect the resin and glass strength properties.

    If I were you, I would use a polyester filler to fill the void, sand flush, key the surrounding suface, then use two-three thin plies of 'doubler' with strands (warp and weft) orientated at 45 degrees to each other (Do not use chopped mat for this, use good quality fibreglass), thus giving you strength in two planes. If you use polyester based system, you should be ok as long as you prep well. Once the repair is cured, ensure that the glass is well 'wetted' no dry strands, then lightly sand to give a finish that is almost flush or flush. You are then ready to cover the repair with colour matched gelcoat. Gelcoat is painted inside the boat mould during construction and the fibreglass laid up over it. Gelcoat will not cure in air (hence it cures under the layers of glass in construction), so my tip is to paint your coloured gelcoat over the repair then use an overhead projector clear transparency sheet and firmly press over the repair to give a smooth finish and exclude the air. Leave it over the gelcoat until it cures, peel of and sand with wet 240 through the grades to 1500+, finishing with a cutting paste. You may have a slightly proud repair, but it should bend in nicely and is not so important if you are using a keel guard to cover it. In your case, strength and integrity is vital, water ingress into the keel area is the kiss of death, particularly for foam filled stringer boats like Mariah's. If water ingresses into the repair, you could suffer from osmosis from the inside out and the outside in = bad news.

    If you use an epoxy filler (West System is good), suggest that you prime and paint the surface with an antifouling as not may other paints are rated for below waterline use.

    Depending on how deep your scratches are, gently try wet 360 and work your way up through the grades to wet 1500 then coarse cutting paste and you will get rid of the worst marks. If there are deeper ones, go easy, you do not want to go through the gelcoat layer as it will look even worse and you will loose the protection over the structure.

    Good luck and post pics!
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    Old 09-23-2011, 10:25 PM   #3

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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    I appreciate the reply and you definitely sound like you know what you're talking about. But you lost me at the if I were you part. I figure if I'm going to be covering it with a keel guard then it doesn't need to be perfect as far as new gelcoat and paint matched and what not. Even if I ever sold the boat in the future I don't think anybody would ever remove the keel guard unless something similar happened to them. What you are describing makes me think I should take it to a professional because I wouldn't even know where to begin. I guess my question is does it look like it needs to be glassed or could it be repaired with the MarineTex epoxy? Don't get me wrong I don't want a cheap quick fix but I've never done this before as far as working with fiberglass. I've used body fillers and epoxy puttys plenty of times befor though so that's not an issue. I appreciate your input
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    Old 09-26-2011, 05:59 PM   #4
     
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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    I think you can get away with epoxy filler if you are going to use the keel guard as the cosmetic appearance is not vital. The most important factor is do you have enough integrity in the surrounding structure (use a coin to tap the surrounding area and check for a change in sound which indicates delamination of the plies) and is the area good enough to ensure adhesion by the epoxy. I would give it a long while to dry out, then clean with some MEK (or propanol) then you can use the filler and sand back flush when its dry. After it has dried, you should have an idea of how structually sound it is. If you are doing this, another quick and easy way to finish is brush a couple of layers of epoxy resin over the top, it adds abrasion resistance and will 'seal' the repair before you fit your keel guard.

    Bet you won't skid up the sand again!
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    Old 09-26-2011, 06:26 PM   #5

    Jgos929 is currently offline
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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by domraga View Post
    I think you can get away with epoxy filler if you are going to use the keel guard as the cosmetic appearance is not vital. The most important factor is do you have enough integrity in the surrounding structure (use a coin to tap the surrounding area and check for a change in sound which indicates delamination of the plies) and is the area good enough to ensure adhesion by the epoxy. I would give it a long while to dry out, then clean with some MEK (or propanol) then you can use the filler and sand back flush when its dry. After it has dried, you should have an idea of how structually sound it is. If you are doing this, another quick and easy way to finish is brush a couple of layers of epoxy resin over the top, it adds abrasion resistance and will 'seal' the repair before you fit your keel guard.

    Bet you won't skid up the sand again!
    Well it hasn't been in the water since Labor Day weekend and I live in TX and we haven't had any rain in forever so I think its probably good and dry.

    I was at West Marine Saturday talking to a guy up there and he recommended a Evercoat polyester repair kit and suggested I use that and put in a couple of patches of fiberglass let it set up and then go over it with the MarineTex to finish it off. What do you think about that idea?



    And no more beaching for me.
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    Old 09-26-2011, 06:42 PM   #6
     
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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    Hey, that sounds like good advice, if you have used filler etc before, its not that difficult. The hardest part is getting a perfect finish, but you don't have to worry about this. My personal preference would be filler then a couple of patches and marine tex will be just fine, just remember epoxy can go over polyester, but not the other way around and you won't go too far wrong.
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    Old 09-26-2011, 07:52 PM   #7

    Jgos929 is currently offline
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    Default Re: Looking for suggestions and recommendations

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by domraga View Post
    Hey, that sounds like good advice, if you have used filler etc before, its not that difficult. The hardest part is getting a perfect finish, but you don't have to worry about this. My personal preference would be filler then a couple of patches and marine tex will be just fine, just remember epoxy can go over polyester, but not the other way around and you won't go too far wrong.
    My plan is to just follow the instructions as far as the polyester part of the project. Applying the MarineTex shouldn't be an issue for me. The guy told me it was super easy just make sure the fiberglass is good and soaked.
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