[bakdraft]

Hi,

I am considering fitting a front ( of vehicle) tow bar. Has any one got any experience of them?

Here is a site with a video demo...

I like the neat remove it to hide it feature....

Add a wireless camera to the stern of the boat... perfect...

Dave

[WetWilly]

Hi bakdraft,

Well now, I've been backing boats down the launch ramps for over 26 years now so I don't see a need for one of these myself at the ramp but I have to admit, it would be nice at home parking the Talari as it can get real tight (little street, limited room).

Now if someone really can't or does not want to learn how to backup a trailer, then this might be a nice addition as long as what ever you’re moving doesn’t weight too much.

The front ends of most vehicles are not rated for a lot more additional weight or stress applied to the steering components. Not too bad with the trucks but I wouldn’t do it to a car and certain not with anything larger that a 18’ or 19’ Mariah unless you have a real truck with a real frame.

Another thing, if you use this towbar and you have a “real boat”, and you only have two wheel rear drive, your driving wheels will now be up hill and all the weight will be on the wheels that steer, might be a little hard getting enough traction. Although it may be a good thing if you have front wheel drive...

Lastly, all the ramps where I boat require you to pull to the parking areas as soon as you trailer your boat and with this towbar, you will have to backup all the way there, which is a lot harder than backing down the ramp!

Again, just my $0.02 worth,
WetWilly

[bakdraft]

Thanks Wet Willy,

Interesting.... Reagards the front, the nose weight for most applications should only be around 50 - 100kg only anyway despite the boat weight. If it is more than this then the trailer is set up incorrectly. Thus I guess the designers of the towbar have considered this..... maybe?

I agree, it is mainly for launching and not recovering as we have the same 'get out of the way' policy here too.

I dont think the pushing front or rear drive should be an issue, as you say the extra nose weight on a front wheel drive should help. Although most people with a big boat > 18 feet would have a 4x4 because the weight of the boat would be heavier than the car and this is not allowed (tail wags the dog)

It looks great to me and for the cost, I think I will give it a go, so I can report back!

For me in the UK, there are often very narrow roads and car parks packed with holidaymakers cars to negociate so maybe its a help

Dave

[WetWilly]

Originally Posted by bakdraft

Interesting.... Reagards the front, the nose weight for most applications should only be around 50 - 100kg only anyway despite the boat weight. If it is more than this then the trailer is set up incorrectly. Thus I guess the designers of the towbar have considered this..... maybe?

Hi Dave,

Well good luck with the Towbar and I'll be waiting for a full report!

I still don’t agree with the 50 to 100kg unless you own a very light trailer or boat and from the examples on the Towbar’s site, that appears to be their case.

I would be curious to know that your tongue weight is. From searching the web for the proper tongue weight, they ranged from 5 to 15 percent, I have found 5% to be a little to light and it caused our trailer to fishtail at times so lets do 7 percent, that’s where my trailer seems to work real well. With that, Mariah says your SX18 weighs 1111kg empty (no petrol, battery or gear) and you say your trailer is 500kg so at 7 percent, that would mean a tongue weight of roughly 113kg, but add 61.18kg for a full tank of petrol, add a battery, ice chest, life jackets and other safety or entertainment gear, etc… and I'd say you SX18 weighs closer to 1218kg so now you have about 120kg on the front.

One last thing, make sure the Towbar will not void your auto insurance or warranty as most vehicles aren’t designed to tow from the front.

WetWilly

[bakdraft]

Originally Posted by WetWilly

Hi Dave,


I would be curious to know that your tongue weight is. From searching the web for the proper tongue weight, they ranged from 5 to 15 percent, I have found 5% to be a little to light and it caused our trailer to fishtail at times so lets do 7 percent, that’s where my trailer seems to work real well. With that, Mariah says your SX18 weighs 1111kg empty (no petrol, battery or gear) and you say your trailer is 500kg so at 7 percent, that would mean a tongue weight of roughly 113kg, but add 61.18kg for a full tank of petrol, add a battery, ice chest, life jackets and other safety or entertainment gear, etc… and I'd say you SX18 weighs closer to 1218kg so now you have about 120kg on the front.

One last thing, make sure the Towbar will not void your auto insurance or warranty as most vehicles aren’t designed to tow from the front.

WetWilly

Most car manufactures specify a maximum ball weight. This the load placed on the ball bow the draw bar (Tongue weight?)

If you take typical cars that can be found the same in most countries:

• BMW 320D = 75Kg
• Mercedes ML Class = 123Kg
• BMW 520D = 90Kg

These figures can be seen in the following article

Thus this is the limiting factor. Note these are maximum weights not ideal weights. Thus I am not sure how an article can base recomendations on a % of the boats weight as to do so could overload the rear of the car. This in itself may void the car insurance if there where an accident. Of course I do not know how it goes in other countries.

Although new to boats, I have happily towed a 1600Kg caravan ( which is like a massive sail ) with nose weights of about 50kg... no problems..... ( By the way I have a factory fitted BMW towbar which includes automatic electronic anti-snake .. this is automatic braking of each car wheel to stop snaking! )

You also need to consider that the front tow bar is for positioning only and NOT towing. There is a big difference between going down the highway at 60mph and possibly having to do an emergency stop at that speed, and positioning the boat.

I currently have big concerns about my nose weight. At the moment I cannot lift it off the ground by hand.... no chance.... which makes me think it is seriously out.

By the way, where did you get the dry weight of the SX18? I have it as 1194Kg
Also, 7% of 1218Kg is 85Kg... or did I miss something.

I really must say thanks for you comments here as it really is helpful to make me think of all the points you rasie.... I will be quizzing the vendor before (if) I buy

Dave

[WetWilly]

Originally Posted by bakdraft

By the way, where did you get the dry weight of the SX18? I have it as 1194Kg
Also, 7% of 1218Kg is 85Kg... or did I miss something.

Hi Dave,

I think you forgot to add the trailer back in...(500kg + 1218kg @7% = 120kg )

1194kg? Maybe this is your “wet” weight (full tank of petrol and all fluids and battery). Mariah’s website says your SX18 weighs 1111kg dry.

1194kg (maybe wet weight?)

35kg (ice chest, life jackets, other safety or entertainment gear,etc)

+ 500kg (trailer)

------------

1729kg (a little heavier than you old caravan)

@ 7%

------------

121kg tongue weight (my earlier guess was pretty close)

I know I may be a little on the heavy side for the ice chest and other equipment at 35kg, so even if we take away 20kg, the tongue weight is still over 119kg.

If you can get the tongue weight down to 5% without any drivability problems then you're down to 86 or 87kg!

Believe me, I know how fast the weight adds up! When our Z240 is loaded for a day on the water, I'm towing over 2857kg, add my SUV and that's over 5543kg going down the load ramp to the water!

You say your not going to use this to "tow" your boat, but at some point your going to have to "push/tow" you SX18 over to the ramp then to the water, after which, you now have to “backup” all the way to the parking area... if it’s close, then not a problem and the front hitch will definitely be a work saver!

Good luck and I hope this hitch works for you,
WetWilly

[bakdraft]

Thanks willy...

Err ... the trailer..... brain fade.... oops forgot that one. It seems you are towing over double my boat weight I'll have to pick up a lot of courage to tow that much!

You do not mention tow ball weight limits... do they not apply to your vehicles?

Interesting about the SX18 weight, the reason I ask is that from 3 different brochures from Mariah I had 3 different weights. In the end I asked Stewart Michell ( Sales Manager at seafox / mariah ) for a definitive weight and he gave me the following

Thank you for inquiring with Mariah Boat Co. The weight of the SX18 w. the 3.0L Mercruiser is about 2637 Lbs. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.

Different again to the Official brochure.

Dave

[il_Mio]

Hi Dave,

I noticed in the brochures the 2007 models quote a dry weight of 2850lbs and 2008 models quote a dry weight of 2450 lbs (and includes the heaviest engine, so a 4.3l and all factory offered options). So somewhere in a years difference Mariah SX18 lost about 400lbs of weight (by using other kind of material within the hull ?). On top of this I gues the fact the fiber glass is also put in by hand means no standard thickness, so no actual standard weight... this compared to the VEC build hulls as used by Glastron and some others.

I think the only thing that is left to be certain is to go to a public weight bridge, if you know a truckdriver or transport company in your area they will be able to tell you where to find one. Regarding your ball weight, just put your ball-head by means of a wooden block on a personal weighing scales (they can cope with 120-150 kg).

Keep us posted, I am very interested in the actual outcome !

Cheers,

Johan

[dudders]

My 2006 SX 18 has a dry weight of 1294kg = 2852lbs
You should be able to get specs from the Mariah / SeaFox web site.

[WetWilly]

Originally Posted by bakdraft

You do not mention tow ball weight limits... do they not apply to your vehicles?

Hi Dave,

The tow ball weight limits are very important and they apply to all vehicles as far as I know.

Our SUV's tow capacity is around 4082kg and it has a Class Three Hitch rated for 226.79kg at 10% tongue weight and my current tongue weight is about 126kg (only 7% of boat/trailer) so you can see, I'm below max tongue weight and my tow ball is rated for 4536kg and is about 60mm in diameter. By using a system called a "weight equalizing hitch", the tongue rating increases to 408.23kg (@10% of max tow capacity). One other thing, she has a 4 wheel air suspension system that keeps everything level, regardless of the weight.

Here's a picture of our tow package to give you an idea of the weight, now imagine ShabahZ250, MariahMan or the other members with larger Mariahs:



As you can see, we tend to take up a few parking spaces (6+1 to get out) when we stop for supplies!

Wetwilly